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2013 Ashes Down Under
Discussion started by nelliec , 22 September, 2013 11:09
2013 Ashes Down Under
nelliec 22 September, 2013 11:09
Everyone will have their own opinion of the ashes squad to be announced tomorrow.This is Alec Stewart's
Certainties;
To my mind, there are 10 players who fit into this category: Alastair Cook, Joe Root, Jonathan Trott, Kevin Pietersen, Ian Bell, Matt Prior, Stuart Broad, Graeme Swann, James Anderson and Tim Bresnan, provided he makes a full recovery from his back injury.
Extra batsman;
Contenders: Michael Carberry, Nick Compton, James Taylor, Gary Ballance, Ravi Bopara.
Back up wicketkeeper;
Contenders: Jonny Bairstow, Jos Buttler, Steve Davies
All-rounder
Contenders: Ben Stokes, Chris Woakes
Second spinner;
Contenders: Monty Panesar, Simon Kerrigan, James Tredwell
Fast bowlers
Contenders: Chris Tremlett, Boyd Rankin, Steven Finn, Graham Onions

His final selection;
Cook, Root, Trott, Pietersen, Bell, Compton, Bairstow, Prior, Stokes, Broad, Swann, Anderson, Bresnan, Tremlett, Rankin, Finn, Panesar

Shame that there's no mention at all about CK, but let's hope he's as good as picking an England team as he is picking a Surrey team.
After Nicks performance against Surrey las week fingers crossed he will get another chance tomorrow



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 29/10/2013 03:51 by Grockle.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Grockle 22 September, 2013 14:11
I'd add a contender to the keepers who has had a better season and is better presently than all of them. I'll leave you to fill in the name - he won't be considered though I can't for the life of me explain why.



(Sm72)

Re: 2013 ashes down under
AGod 22 September, 2013 14:29
If you are referring to Kieswetter and we are talking about the Test leg of the tour, I'm pretty sure that Kieswetter has a worse first-class batting average this season than any of the three guys listed above (Bairstow, Buttler and Davies).

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Grockle 22 September, 2013 15:09
Really? You'd put your life on the other 3 out batting Craig would you? Don't include me in that group I like life too much.

Craig is the best keeper batsman in the country and I personally don't give a toss what the stats from now to God knows when in the past they relate say.

But hey, you go with the stats and take Bairstow - he's proved such a good choice up to now. Oh and by the way - on the basis of that analysis Jos isn't even a four day keeper presently.



(Sm72)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 22/09/2013 15:21 by Grockle.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
AGod 22 September, 2013 15:32
He has a better average this season than CK, I'm afraid.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Grockle 22 September, 2013 15:39
That's why he keeps and bats up the order in the Somerset 4 day side I suppose.

Unfortunately if England went on merit a hole bunch of favourites would be fighting for their places - guess what they aren't.

Stats are one thing, heart, experience and present form are three others...you go with your one - until it doesn't fit your requirements, that's the usual ploy. I'll go with a little more than that although it makes no difference. If Nick has a chance then Jos and Craig have none anyway.

It won't be the first time Stewart has been part of ignoring taking the best man for the job.. he got in against a better candidate for the post some years ago himself.



(Sm72)

Re: 2013 ashes down under
AGod 22 September, 2013 16:30
Sorry, but the reality is that none of the possible candidates for a reserve wicket-keeper berth have made anything like an unarguable case for their selection this season, and that includes Kieswetter - who has been part of our batting woes this season.

Ironically, of course, Prior himself had a terrible Ashes series, too, so it's not even as though the selectors can feel 100% great about him.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Grockle 22 September, 2013 16:40
Who are you apologising to?

I don't care what your opinion is and stating it over and over again isn't going to change my view.

You know that, I know that so who are you putting this to?

Someone has to put a case for the second berth but they'll only play if Prior is injured so whether they have made a 'good' case or not is totally irrelevant anyway.

So - Craig for me irrelevant as it is. Oh have I already said that?



(Sm72)

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Mike TA1 22 September, 2013 16:59
Just a reminder that both our wicket keepers haven't played in all CC match, I don't know about the others being talked about.

Craig K, played in ten matches with a batting average of 35.62 with 38 dismissals in 16 innings.

Jos B, played in only eight matches with a batting average of 38.07 with 9 dismissals in 4 innings.

I will take that average any time.

Edit - my post is not in reply to any one post it is just to say season stats doesn't always tell the complete story,



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 22/09/2013 17:05 by Mike TA1.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Grockle 22 September, 2013 17:10
True Mike - stats are one part of a story but not the only part



(Sm72)

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Clarence Parker 22 September, 2013 17:17
Quote:
Grockle

It won't be the first time Stewart has been part of ignoring taking the best man for the job.. he got in against a better candidate for the post some years ago himself.

Do you mean Alec Stewart?

What part will he play in selecting the side to tour Australia this winter?

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Grockle 22 September, 2013 17:23
He won't Clarence. I didn't say he would be.



(Sm72)

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Grizzers 22 September, 2013 17:29
Not sure that CK's recent bad day behind the stumps in the Championship will have helped his case unfortunately.

Grizzzly

Re: 2013 ashes down under
AGod 22 September, 2013 17:40
In the long-run, I'd say the competition to succeed Prior is fairly open, to be honest.

Davies, I think, the best keeper of the four but the selectors will probably decide mainly on who they think the best batsman is.

Bairstow has had a bit of a go with the bat and not really come off and neither of our guys have ever played a Test and I don't think Davies has either?

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Frome Exile 22 September, 2013 19:23
I think there's a good chance that if Davies goes, Compton won't; as the slots in the batting order that Davies "naturally" covers, would be 1,2 & 3.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Grockle 22 September, 2013 19:53
If 'faces' don't 'fit' they won't go FE and a lot of the 'non fitting' faces are South Western.



(Sm72)

Re: 2013 ashes down under
AGod 22 September, 2013 21:25
I don't understand, FE... do you mean Davies would be covering the 1, 2 and 3 slots for the ODIs?

Surrey have been batting him at six in the CC, so not at all obvious that he would be any kind of natural cover for slots 1, 2 and 3 in the Test side?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 22/09/2013 21:47 by AGod.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Loyal of Lhasa. 22 September, 2013 21:28
VJM in The Observer came up with much the same set of names as Stewart. That's hardly surprising in that there is a nucleus of ten or so who are virtually bound to be selected. However he made an interesting suggestion for the second spinner, namely Rayner (who is also not at all a bad bat).



LoL

Sixty-six Seasons a Somerset Supporter

Re: 2013 ashes down under
nelliec 22 September, 2013 21:51
The selectors normally chuck a young wild card in the squad, but with the lions there anyway they can probably pick and choose as they please. Hopefully Craig,Jos,Nick,and Jove should all feature during our winter

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Frome Exile 22 September, 2013 23:08
Davies, irrespective of how Surrey have been (mis)using him, is by nature an opening bat. And has been one for most of his career. Selecting him for the main tour (which I don't think for one moment they will do) would enable them to forego selecting a third "opener".

Re: 2013 ashes down under
AGod 23 September, 2013 00:11
Davies used to bat at six for Worcestershire in first-class cricket as well, so I'm not sure why you are dubbing him an opening batsman 'by nature'???

Certainly, in 2008 and 2009 when playing for Worcestershire he was at number six in all of their home games, I've not bothered to check the away ones but obviously no logical reason to suppose somebody would bat six at home but then open away.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 23/09/2013 00:13 by AGod.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Grockle 23 September, 2013 03:23
Must be his stats.... they tell all.



(Sm72)

Re: 2013 ashes down under
AGod 23 September, 2013 08:20
Daft comment. The reality is that Davies has NOT spent most of his time as an opener at all which was my point, Grockle.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Frome Exile 23 September, 2013 09:40
So it seems that, in terms of the raw numbers at least, my memory is pkaying tricks with me. Davies' career has been played largely in the middle order, but with frequent short spells opening the batting or at first drop.
Interestingly, he once batted at three for England U19 when the innings was opened by one J Hildreth.
However, the point remains that he has experience as an opener, as well as a sound technique snd phlegmatic temperament. And whenever he's been "mentioned in despatches" for England, the fact that he can cover 1,2 & 3 has been part if the duscussion.
I don't think he'll go. I din't think Nick will either. I'm almost certain that they won't both be on the plane.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
North Berwick John 23 September, 2013 09:43
Mike Selvey discussing Ashes team selection in this morning's Guardian, backs Compton, but describes him as "anecdotally distant" - whatever that means.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
AGod 23 September, 2013 09:49
It just means that 'sources', have told Mike Selvey that NC is not necessarily the most 'clubbable', guy in the world.

Of course, it might also be that the England dressing room is not a terribly welcoming place for newcomers.

FE - do you think they'll take Carberry? Or cover the top three by picking a back up for Ian Bell with the idea that Bell would move up if one of the top three is hors de combat?

Perhaps Ballance and maybe even Bairstow both in the squad, but only one to play in the first XI with the other coming in at number 5 if Bell is needed higher up the order?

Re: 2013 ashes down under
AGod 23 September, 2013 09:56
Although with a full Lions tour going to Aus then I suppose they don't have to pick any cover?

One might even say that they'd be better off - once the tour starts - just picking an XI for each Test and sending the other 5 or 6 members of the squad off to play for the Lions?

So instead of naming, say, 32 cricketers to fill 22 places between the first XI and Lions XI, it might be better to name only 26 or 27 players to go Down Under this winter such that at least most of the players will be playing most of the time?

Re: 2013 ashes down under
geordie moonraker 23 September, 2013 10:09
Yesterday's Sunday Times preferred Carberry to Compton. I'm not sure why- older,poorer average- but we shall see.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
Frome Exile 23 September, 2013 10:16
There is a great deal of speculation about how the fact that the Performance Squad (not technically a Lions tour, I believe) will effect the way the squad is constituted.
The Sky panel felt, for example, that the Ashes party per se might contain only one spinner, in Swann, but that perhaps as many as three would go with the EPP. It'll be an interesting selection, that's for sure.

Re: 2013 ashes down under
AGod 23 September, 2013 12:10
Huge black mark for Giles, Whittaker and Miller for being petty and pathetic in not selecting NC.

I like Carberry a lot. I think he's a good player.

But can we seriously doubt that NC is being punished for speaking out about his omission?

Current Page: 1 of 30

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