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MESSAGES->author
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Grockle (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 10:26
I didn't say they had Chunky.

I don't know who is leaving. Do you? Or who is available to fill those gaps properly.

That will be off season work as it usually is.

I do know we have some interesting players coming through from our own Academy. Do Warwickshire or is that why they are looking to buy other people's?



(Sm72)

 
chunkyinargyll
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
chunkyinargyll (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 10:35
Grockle- My post was in response to 'What has Ashley Giles done?'

Well, if you include a couple of local kids, he's signed half a team in a couple of months.

On the face of it, Somerset haven't done anything yet.

The early bird catches the worm.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Grockle (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 10:39
Well they have Chunky. They just haven't spent money on new first team talent.

And how nourishing is the worm the Brummies have caught? Has this new 5 person team mada a drastic initial change or not. Surrey spend loadsa money and they got what?



(Sm72)

 
chunkyinargyll
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
chunkyinargyll (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 10:46
You don't think Hose, Rhodes, Sibley and Sidebottom are first team talent?

Giles knows he has to get the age profile of his team down- so he is making intelligent 'Poundland' signings. Players he rates, who haven't had opportunities at their present counties.

Maybe Maynard should do the same.

 
Mike BOS
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Mike TA1 (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 10:56
The early bird catches the worm

I agree with that regarding contracts, to hear something at the Q&A on the lines of contract will be concluded by Christmas (or something like that)

That is much too late, players need to know much sooner than that especially the younger players in the seconds, they need to know where they will be playing next season or they will go else where.

 
AGod
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
AGod (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 10:57
Given that Hose and Sibley both had multi-year deals on the table, it's very unlikely that they constitute 'Poundland signings.'

Sure, they'll have cost less than proven first team players for whom there was a market but the very fact that Warks were competing with the players' existing counties will have pushed the price up. And both Surrey and Somerset are amongst the top 4/5 (one in Surrey's case) in terms of wage bills in the game, so the offers made to Sibley/Hose are unlikely to have been desultory.

 
chunkyinargyll
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
chunkyinargyll (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 11:05
'Poundland' in the sense that Giles hasn't broken the bank to sign someone of the stature of the soon to retire Sangakkara.

These days most (all?) counties have players on full year long contracts. For the players that means October is the one month they can have a good holiday, with pre-season training unbelievably starting in November. With that in mind, you can understand why players want new deals tied up before the season is over (so they can have October holiday)

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Grockle (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 11:05
I don't know Chunky. Do you think.Steve Davies is first team talent? Maynard bought him this year with much approval at the time and much criticism as some kind of idiot when he didn't produce for half a season.

The quality of the signing is in the performance isn't it? Is Giles the Great strategist now because he has spent money? Will he become the@#$%&coach next year if his purchases make little difference?

Shall we wait and see perhaps?



(Sm72)

 
chunkyinargyll
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
chunkyinargyll (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 11:08
But Steve Davies must now be thought of in terms of 'last year'.

What is Maynard planning for 2018?

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Grockle (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 11:13
It doesn't matter when the purchase was made in relation to the quality of the purchase which is what you were allùding to in relation to Sibley et al.

Davies was just an example of the fact that spending money is not a simple guarantee of success.

I don't know what the DoC of Somerset is planning. Am I supposed to? I can't remember knowing in the middle of August in the past.



(Sm72)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 18/08/2017 11:17 by Grockle.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Grockle (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 11:26
Eddie Byrom, Tim Rouse, Tom Banton, George Bartlett, Tom Lammomby along with Tom Abell, Craig and Jamie Overton, Lewis Gregory, Dom Bess and Jack Leach aren't 'Pounland' signings, they are home grown. That seems to be a Maynard strategy if a more long term rather than 'plug the hole' type.

Is it better? Well neither has really been given time to see yet in the case of the newer boys. Will Adam Hose do well at Warks? I don't know but I wish him well.

Will we have a predominently self reared Somerset team of successful professionals. Doñ't know that either but I hope so?

Is one method better than the other? Not sure but I know which one I'd rather put my hopes behind.



(Sm72)

 
AGod
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
AGod (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 12:10
It's obviously a nonsense idea to suppose that either method is intrinsically better. It all depends on the quality of players developed/imported.

In days of yore, one might have supposed that one could expect more 'loyalty,' from 'developed,' players than from imports but I'm not sure that holds anymore.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Grockle (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 12:14
Has a club bought its way out of trouble in the past? I mean as a major policy decision?

Have to agree with you AG. It surely has to be a mixture of the best of both and I suppose the best DoC's or whatever are the ones who can marry the two together.



(Sm72)

 
Loyal of Lhasa
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Loyal of Lhasa (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 12:52
I think the word "better" is irrelevant as far as I am concerned. I just enjoy Somerset cricket all the more when most of the side have come through the county's own system. For much of this and last season that has applied to at least seven members of the team; I think there was one match when it applied to nine and I doubt any other county, even Yorkshire, can often boast of that these days. A quick count from the Almanac I indicates there are fourteen "locals" on the books this year.

Heaven forbid we ever go down the sad road taken by senior football sides in England, where the bulk of the teams seem to be qualified for countries other than England and few of those who are thus qualified have any local affiliation.



LoL

Seventy Seasons a Somerset Supporter

 
Roger ivanhoe
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Roger ivanhoe (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 13:42
M.M. remark at the Q & A made little sense if he was referring to those whose contracts expire in September, will they be unemployed for 3 months.

 
Angell Face
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Angell Face (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 14:00
like LoL, I like to see as many "home grown" players as possible in the team and it certainly looks as though we have a good batch of players coming through from the second team. I shall be disappointed if we are relegated to Div.2 but not downhearted. Look at Essex. Div.2 for a number of years, promoted last year and likely to win the CC this year. If I was a betting man I would have put money on them going straight back to Div.2 but suddenly most of their players seem to have come good. A few years back Lancs won the CC and were relegated the next year. I really can't see that Maynard and the club have done a lot wrong in terms of recruitment and I'm happy to go with the squad we have with the addition of a good top order batsmen to replace Marcus.

 
Farmer White
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Farmer White (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 14:01
My recollection of the Q&A is that MM's remarks about Christmas referred specifically to contract extensions for players due to fall out of contract in 2018.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Grockle (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 14:21
That info tends to appear early September on recollection. It may be later because it may he dependent on our Championship position.



(Sm72)

 
Wickham
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Wickham (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 14:28
I knew that, if I waited, others (in this case, LoL and AF) would express feelings similar to my own.

 
AGod
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
AGod (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 14:32
You can change 'better,' to 'more likely to be conducive to success,' if you prefer LOL.

There would be no point in coming last with a home grown team, having taken a policy decision to be the cricketing equivalent of Atlético Bilbao (who only field Basque players).

Some might say that there'd be no point winning it with an entirely imported team. I would say that that point of view would be to misunderstand the point of professional, as distinct from amateur, sport.

But, in reality, it is very unlikely that any team could produce an entirely home grown AND successful line-up. And, I would suggest that Surrey are alone in having the financial resources to produce a successful team that is entirely imported.

We need to pursue a blend. Some of our home grown players and two of our imported ones may be about to leave. We have a number of younger players already in our first XI that have the potential to be members of a trophy winning side, but I doubt it would be prudent to try and replace all of those that may be about to leave from within.

 
AGod
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
AGod (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 14:35
Angell Face mentions Essex. Like him 95% of folks would have put a wager on them returning directly whence they came..

...Of possible relevance viz Essex. They stuck with Simon Grayson through years and years of inadequate performance before finally getting shot of him. I confess to having totally forgotten the ID of the man in charge now but he appears to have done a sterling job and certainly one light-years better than PG did.

 
AGod
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
AGod (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 14:43
Chris Silverwood is the man in question. One doesn't often seem to hear from him in the media etc, so that's my excuse for forgetting him - sorry, Chris.

 
Loyal of Lhasa
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Loyal of Lhasa (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 15:08
Perhaps Silverwood does not need to be prominent in the media because his splendid team are doing all the talking for him.



LoL

Seventy Seasons a Somerset Supporter

 
AGod
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
AGod (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 15:16
Indeed.

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Grockle (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 20:10
And because his side are performing it is probable that he is not criticised for breathing every day on the social media and websites in the area



(Sm72)

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Grockle (IP Logged)
18 August, 2017 20:22
The longevity and internal development of a team depends on a youth policy and players who tie their career to a county. That is the way you develop a core and keep it moving forward.

No one would expect us to pick a total side from the Academy but no one would expect us to pick no one who had come through the youth stages either. The people coming to the end and who are the backbone of our side have to some extent come through the stages of Somerset. Marcus, Trigger and James. The ones looking to take their place have followed them Lewis, The Overtons, Tom, Jack and the ones looking for their place in the start up are leaving the cocoon now to join the full side and make their mark.

The International and the signings/kolpaks who fill the roles that our Academy have not covered must fit the gaps - Rogers, Langer, Willow, Alf, Zander, and many more.

Some don't and that may have been a problem in the past few years. Tim has. Jim probably hasn't though it was with the right plan in mind that he was signed. Dean has Jayawardene probably didn't. Steve Davies hasn't but we must hope for a better second season and if it isn't there then Tom or Ryan are at least there to step up.

We need those gap fillers in the winter for places that will exist. Jim's place. Pete doesn't seem to be quite finished yet according to the score from Hampshire, Johann if he is going to teach full time, Marcus maybe. Dean?

Those gap fillers are the glue that can hold a side together and build on the Core. Somerset has the Core...... not sure about the whole team.



(Sm72)

 
MisterMurph
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
MisterMurph (IP Logged)
19 August, 2017 08:54
Quote:
Grockle
And because his side are performing it is probable that he is not criticised for breathing every day on the social media and websites in the area

Nope - couldn't be more wrong...

 
Shepton Paul 2
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Shepton Paul 2 (IP Logged)
19 August, 2017 10:24
No, I don't feel like we're going backwards. We may not be going as far forwards as we'd like, but we are gradually forming a younger, largely home-grown squad of very good players. The likes of Jason Kerr and Steve Snell seem to be doing a good job with the current under 21s, all under MM's direction.

It may take a year or two in Div Two to come to fruition (I hope not), but I believe our team will be all the better for this period in a year or two. Whether MM is absolutely the best to take us through to the promised land, I'm not certain, but I do have faith that he will do a good job, assuming he stays.

We probably will lose one or two along the way, drawn Hose-like to bigger salaries and Test-hosting concrete bowls, but the likes of Abell, Gregory, the Overton's, Leach and Bess allied to the West Country-honed experience of Tres (in whatever capacity), Hildreth and Trego (ditto) plus TG and SD, one or two overseas players and a good crop of an even younger generation, give me a lot of hope for the playing side of the club - if the ECB allow...

 
MESSAGES->author
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
Grockle (IP Logged)
19 August, 2017 10:26
Is he getting stick locally then Murph? Maybe it's the burden of a DoC then.



(Sm72)

 
AGod
Re: Does it feel like we are going backwards under Matthew Maynard
AGod (IP Logged)
19 August, 2017 12:05
He might have got stick from the T20 fans?

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