Latest news:


WELCOME TO THE MIDDLESEX ROOM, THE ONLY MESSAGE BOARD ON THE INTERNET DEDICATED TO MIDDLESEX CCC

Eating away over the winter


Goto Page: Previous12
Current Page: 2 of 2
Re: It's all about culture
Darren Gosling 02 October, 2019 00:07
Interesting Law said blaming the pitch was a negative thing to say...…
Gus Fraser when asked at a Forum earlier this season why we gained so few batting points last season (2018) blamed er …. the pitches at Lords!!!
Good to see that the coach and director of cricket are on the same page(!)
NB Incidentally 11 of the 14 batting points gained in 2018 were at Lords with only 3pts gained away - proving Gus doesn't know what he is talking about as usual.....unless he thinks the pitches away from Lords were even worse. excuses, excuses, excuses

Re: It's all about culture
Sussex Seaxe 02 October, 2019 14:05
The living in London business has two elements, I think. Living in and enjoying the lifestyle is one thing. I would hope that most people with character could cope with that as millions who live and work there have to. If not, then maybe they are not suited to Middlesex.

The other is the housing cost, which I do think is a genuine issue. In my working days before self-employment (or loafing around, as Mrs Seaxe calls it), those of us in my international company who lived and worked in London were paid greater allowances in recognition of the costs involved; I've no idea if Middlesex can afford to do that, but suspect not. I am also involved in a school in the south east (not London) and can guarantee that the cost of housing is a huge factor in getting very few applicants for jobs from people elsewhere in the country.

Cricketers are, I think, better paid than they used to be, but unless they are internationals, are not hugely wealthy. We shouldn't underestimate these factors when looking to recruit players.

Re: It's all about culture
Seaxe_man1 02 October, 2019 18:26
Some interesting possibilities for our overseas player next year.

Re: It's all about culture
Seaxe_man1 02 October, 2019 18:47
Quote:
snicko
Sowter played as our frontline spinner in Championship matches and returned 14 wickets at an average of 46 !
Very valid points made re housing costs. Despite the salary caps for Middlesex and Surrey being in excess of the other 16 Counties, you won’t get much within Zone 4 for £600,000 (which would pay for a large detached house with garden in most other counties).

Wouldn’t have thought that many of the Middlesex squad are earning in excess of £100,000. You do the maths.

Players do have to make lifestyle choices.
Those 14 wickets at 46 were garnered at the back end of the season when spinning tracks apart from a couple of places aren't the norm. Certainly the Lord's track wasnt and neither was OT.

Re: It's all about culture
rod/ed 02 October, 2019 20:31
Quote:
Seaxe_man1
Some interesting possibilities for our overseas player next year.

Ross Taylor fits the bill. Alan Coleman spoke highly of his attitude and influence off the park.

Re: It's all about culture
Primrose Hillbilly 02 October, 2019 20:42
Normally, a leg spinner coming on to bowl guarantees that things WILL HAPPEN.

Sowter has been an utter revelation.

I must have drowsed through every single spell he has bowled. He neither threatens with monstrous spin,nor horrendous bounce, nor a range of deliveries that make him hard to pick. He just trundles in, goes for a few runs, then scurries round the outfield between overs.

When he takes a wicket, it comes as a bit of a surprise. It's never because he's put the batsman through an over of utterly bewildering "couldn't lay a bat on him", groping, humiliation, and then finished him off.

I have never even seen anyone else look up and start taking notice when he comes on. Sowter is the least charismatic leg spinner I have ever come across, and the most anonymous fielder. Who's that one? .........err, well, going round, Simmo, then Robbo and Mala in the slips, that's Toby, there's Gubbins, Helm's the tall one, Tim's the dark one................so that must be Sowter by process of elimination.

I have to believe that unless he develops some variations during the close season, "the word" that will have gone out round the circuit that he is pretty innocuous will become completely justified next season - at our expense.

My hope is that we once had quite a good leg spinner, but the captain would not bowl him enough. Now Dawid has stood down, maybe we will get more overs out of him.

OMFG...........Titmus, Edmonds, Emburey, Tufnell, Weekes, Peploe even ........

Re: It's all about culture
adelaide 03 October, 2019 01:34
PH

To me Sowter still looks like a one day spinner and he hasn't really taken what opportunities there were in the CC, though come to think of it not many spinners have taken wickets against us either (perhaps because we are 35-6 too often). His batting has made things happen more frequently than his bowling. He is surely one of the best fielders in the team, anonymous or otherwise.

Reading between the lines, Sowter as main spinner says to me that we will quite often not be playing a spinner at all next year, a depressing thought. Malan (if still here) is surely not up to bowling long spells.

I can think of less effective Middlsex leggies. Yogi Gowalkar and early Imran Tahir, for a start.

Now if we can get an overseas batsman who also bowls decent spin. Labuschagne? Williamson? (I almost wrote Stirling...).


Adelaide

Re: It's all about culture
chunkyinargyll 03 October, 2019 07:14
Primrose throwing in a hand grenade!

There's definitely a breed of spinner who can take wickets in white ball cricket, when the batsmen have to attack, but can't do so in red ball cricket.

It was right he got a chance in the championship side and I hope he improves, but I don't think (so far) he has convinced people that he will be our first choice spinner for the next ten years.

Considerably more expensive than Rayner- both in terms of runs per over conceeded and wickets taken.

But unless we are planning to sign an established county spinner from somewhere it's going to be Sowter plus a couple of spinners in their first year (assuming we sign Walallawita and Holman)

As Ollie obviously didn't want to leave it might have been wise to hang on to him for a little longer.

Re: It's all about culture
dingy bags 03 October, 2019 09:11
Books have to balance, Chunky. County contacts tend to be incremental - you get a bit more with each new contract. So, Ollie would be on a good wage and on a better one with a new deal. With both he and Stirlo off the salary bill, we have every chance to 'reinvest' in an overseas batsman. Cummins will cost more than Barber, so that 'swap' is an increase.

Of course, if Mala goes (we all hope not), that frees up more cash.

Re: It's all about culture
Primrose Hillbilly 03 October, 2019 12:29
A nostrum of the game is that spinners tend to improve with age, Chunky, I will grant that.

Just as Sowter will have been looked at by others, I hope he will have similarly researched his subject when next he comes on to bowl, and has learned a bit.

From watching him, I suspect that Sowter just does not have that seriously "big ripped" turning leg spinner in his armoury that - once unsheathed - is in the batsman's mind every delivery thereafter. If you have that, it keeps the batsmen honest when playing every ball and other variation.

Re: It's all about culture
Seaxe_man1 03 October, 2019 12:46
PH. Tuffers in 1985 was described in similar terms. Went on to get 121 for England pre DRS and 842 for Mx. Sowter fielding and batting already better than Phil's. Took a sensational T20 catch as sub at Uxbridge . Can be viewed on YouTube. He may turn out as you say but I hope not. Last time there a turning track at Lord's was 1976 when Jin Fairbrother was groundsman. Smokey Featherstone picked up 30 wickets in August and we won the Championship.

Re: It's all about culture
Seaxe_man1 03 October, 2019 12:49
Quote:
rod/ed
Quote:
Seaxe_man1
Some interesting possibilities for our overseas player next year.

Ross Taylor fits the bill. Alan Coleman spoke highly of his attitude and influence off the park.
Good shout Rod. Or Faf du Plessis who is jacking in international cricket.

Re: It's all about culture
Seaxe_man1 03 October, 2019 12:56
Plus chunky. Rayner was a slow bowler not a spinner. His batting had evaporated and I would lhave liked to have seen his outfield bleep test. Not a lot of running in the slips. There were some other issues besides on the culture front. Rossington was offloaded due to bleep test failure. Interesting to have seen the comparison with OR.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/10/2019 12:59 by Seaxe_man1.

Re: It's all about culture
chunkyinargyll 03 October, 2019 17:53
S-M

I've seen Rayner get the ball to turn in matches on Sky.

I think he might have self deprecatingly referred to himself as a slow bowler, but at this level it's often tiny fractions of spin that gets a batsman out, particularly if you have deliberately not made any attempt to get the previous three or four deliveries to spin. I think it's called subtlety.

What is unusual is you wouldn't normally let the senior player go until you were sure the junior player had overtaken him productivity wise, which is why Rayner is entitled to be a bit miffed.

Sowter is a bit like an enthusiastic young puppy dog, so I expect Law was impressed with the 'energy' he brings, rather than Rayner who comes across as your more laid back philosophical type of cricketer, so I suppose he was an easy target if Law wanted to wake everyone up.

Re: It's all about culture
Seaxe_man1 03 October, 2019 18:09
Can't see why he should be. Had nine years at Mx. A number of which were not very productive. Further, as we move on, club have tried to assist him with another club. In his hands now. Your comment that it is tiny fractions which get the batsmen out could apply equally to Sowts.

Goto Page: Previous12
Current Page: 2 of 2

Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
We record all IP addresses on the Sportnetwork message boards which may be required by the authorities in case of defamatory or abusive comment. We seek to monitor the Message Boards at regular intervals. We do not associate Sportnetwork with any of the comments and do not take responsibility for any statements or opinions expressed on the Message Boards. If you have any cause for concern over any material posted here please let us know as soon as possible by e-mailing abuse@sportnetwork.net