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Eating away over the winter

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Re: Tom Lace leaves - for Gloucs!
chunkyinargyll 20 August, 2020 13:35
Well said, Primrose.

Lace will be gutted if Gloucestershire become one of the teams to go 'part time'

Suggestions up to six counties may play white ball cricket only, leaving the other 12 to play each other once (so 11 games) in the championship.

This could even encourage some new part time clubs (maybe a combined Devon and Cornwall)

Those counties would only have to pay players for about 4 months a year (4-6 weeks preparation, followed by T20 and 50 over comps)

The other 12 counties retain full time status and greater ECB grant (and presumably could take some players from the six 'part time' counties for the championship, as the part-timers wouldn't be in action during the championship part of the season)

As MCC members want to watch 4 day cricket at Lord's, Middle should be safe.

As for the part timers, my guess would be Leicestershire, Northamptonshire, Derbyshire, Gloucestershire, Durham and one other. On playing ability the one other should be Glamorgan.

Anyway, maybe it won't come to that- but seriously up for discussion.

Re: Tom Lace leaves - for Gloucs!
chunkyinargyll 20 August, 2020 13:52

There has been no explanation of why Lace was not selected for the first two matches...he had been associated with Middlesex for over 10 years and played just one first class match when we were desperate and short of players last season. He demonstrated his capabilities at Derbyshire but still did not get his chance at Middlesex. No problem with Lace’s actions...he did the right thing...if anything he should have left earlier..

It would be helpful if the club could give some background on Lace's departure. Maybe they can't for confidentiality reasons, but I expect members will ask at the next online forum.

For all we know, maybe Lace was demanding an assurance before the team against Surrey was even announced. Maybe that's why he never featured in the first game.

Or maybe he just sat back and waited to see if he was picked for the first game.

But the speed at which this happened suggests it was already in his mind even before the Surrey game. I mean- it takes time to contact your agent and for him to see if another county might be interested, and for him to get back to you and set up negotiations etc. Almost as if Gloucestershire (possibly with Higgins as go between) had already said they would offer him a 'guarantee'.

This has all happened so quickly I think it was probably bubbling under even before the squad for Surrey was announced- so mabe that's why he was left out.

Re: Tom Lace leaves - for Gloucs!
freddie tittlemouse 20 August, 2020 14:02
I have never seen a post with so many perhaps, suggests, probablys, possibles in it, Chunky. Clearly you are s great fan of conspiracy theories.

Re: Tom Lace leaves - for Gloucs!
chunkyinargyll 20 August, 2020 14:13
It was organised PDQ wasn't it Freddie.

Counties should only approach players in the final year of their contract.

Feels like Lace already had his escape route planned.

Re: Tom Lace leaves - for Gloucs!
snicko 20 August, 2020 15:10
May I suggest a pertinent question that deserves a straight answer from the next online forum :-

How much money has been paid to agents by Middlesex in each of the last 5 seasons ?

E.g. Franklin, Fuller, Cummins, Vettori, deVilliers etc.

Agents make money through commissions via transfers \ contract extensions \ overseas placements etc. In the case of a player moving clubs, agents commissions are often negotiated to form part of the player’s contract and consequently the agent is paid via the acquiring club. This is a similar scenario to football and rugby.

They often entice young players with promises of equipment contracts, free food supplements and hospitality tickets etc. in exchange for the right to negotiate playing contracts, saving players the “hassle” of haggling/justifying their worth. Break clauses are often added to playing contracts that trigger upon certain events e.g. relegation, or, as in Lace’s case an appearance caveat.

With that caveat in place, and with Middlesex assessing that playing 2 spinners in the first 2 games would be the way to go, it would have been a straight choice between Andersson and Lace for the final batting spot, and I would suggest that Stuart Law got that one absolutely right. Player expresses his disappointment to agent and the rest is history.

It is therefore in the agents best interests to engineer moves. Whether or not said agents have the players best interests to the fore is debatable.

Personally, I am firmly of the opinion that all agents are parasites.

Re: Tom Lace leaves - for Gloucs!
Seaxe_man1 20 August, 2020 16:43
If all this part time guff put around by Graves and quickly taken up by the scribblers comes to pass. Where will this leave Test cricket? Graves reckons the ICC is a massive job. We know also he wants four day Tests. We await with bated breath. Up until the early sixties county cricket was pretty much part time. Amateurs were used and pro contracts were April to September. You needed a winter job. Amateurs started to disappear in the early sixties as did dual cricketer/footballers. A few like Ted Hemsley, Worcs and Sheff U made it until the early eighties. So part time not as new as Graves reckons. Your list of part-time counties chunky have more assets than Mx. Your claim we are safe ignores The Spirit of London kicking off soon depending on Covid-19. Australians were amateurs until Alan Border filled in his tax return stating he was a professional cricketer The first county to give out all year contracts was I think Lancashire..

Re: Tom Lace leaves - for Gloucs!
freddie tittlemouse 20 August, 2020 17:55
Many cricketers used to sign up for unemployment benefit for 6 months in the winter, even Alan Knott I think. Others were paid retainers by companies with cricket loving MDs for doing diddly squat.

Re: Tom Lace leaves - for Gloucs!
Primrose Hillbilly 20 August, 2020 19:55
I'd love to know from where this idea that producing England players is in Middlesex's DNA comes.

Equally, on what basis can it confirmed that Eskinazi - no England, Australia or even South African youth or development team selection whatsoever, and hasn't set the world on fire for us ever, Gubbins - England Lions only, no England youth teams, or Holden -England Under 19 only, all languishing in Division 2, are thought of as being potential England picks by anybody within the management group, such that their development will eventually see them centrally contracted, so they "block" selection of others now. - Anybody got any, ........y'know,......... proof?

That idea is utterly barking and really has to be called out for the speculative bilge it is, unless it can be genuinely substantiated.

You pick a Middlesex team to win the next match. You pick players that you believe give you the best chance of doing that. Their weight of runs or wickets might get them noticed, but much more importantly - and that is all the selection group will be focused on - it will get Middlesex some wins and might even get us promotion or prize money.

No one from the ECB will look at players in a Div 2 side, and suddenly spring them a central contract unless given good reason, and no one picks a player now because they might possibly indirectly make the club some money from the ECB in a couple of years time.

Lawman etc picked the sides on the basis above. Have to assume they considered all contenders, including Tom Lace and passed him over. Tom then made his decision.

Re: Tom Lace leaves - for Gloucs!
Seaxe_man1 21 August, 2020 17:54
To answer your question Primrose the England DNA requirement comes from top table. I'd like a tenner for every time I have heard that phrase at forums and AGMs. The reason given is that it provides a revenue stream of which we have few, four at last the ECB provide dough for the development by the relevant county during the duration of players England career. Currently only Eoin Morgan fits that bill. The danger with the England DNA guesstimates are that snap judgements can be made too early. Late developers are not unknown.. Your analysis of our current players prospects is accurate.

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